Buttercream with shortening

I read heaps of posts on Facebook where woman overseas use shortening instead of butter for buttercream. Does anyone know what brand we could use and the ratios of the recipe. apparently its better than butter. Thank you in advance

Chef_nzbrat, Jun 7, 7:43 pm

Possibly something like this

Chef_eljayv, Jun 7, 8:35 pm

I see Kremelta is labelled Vegetable Shortening. Iíve never used it for icing.
Kremelta must be fresh, if it is, it has very little taste. Let us know how you get on. Sorry canít help re amounts.

Chef_strowan1, Jun 8, 3:20 am

Kremelta is hydrogenated coconut oil. Why would anyone want to stick that crap into their bodies? Even the Americans have banned hydrogenated fats.

Chef_buzzy110, Jun 8, 4:03 am

If I make buttercream once a year I really stick to a very expensive nice non-salted butter.

Of course if that is something you eat every week then you might have to compromise to keep the cost down. Try using a soft margarine type spread.

Or you could try these which are not hydrogenated:
https://www.ceres.co.nz/ingredients/oils/palm-shortening/ http://www.wisecicada.co.nz/spectrum-organic-all-vegetable-shortening-non-hydrogenated-680g

Of course that brings us to the palm oil debate .

Chef_uli, Jun 8, 4:45 am

Do you mean that palm oil is depleting orangutan habitat, altering and causing massive loss of biodiversity and making natives in the area it is grown into virtual slaves to one single monoculture at risk of massive financial losses if the crop begins to fail, - that sort of thing?

Chef_buzzy110, Jun 8, 5:09 am

What is the matter with you that you need to come on and preach in your overbearing manner. The rest of the replies were merely offering assistance to OP., not judging their merits.
This is why we see less and less participation in Recipes, who wants to be jumped on for offering an alternative that differs from yours.

Chef_strowan1, Jun 8, 7:45 pm

Yes buzzy110 - THAT sort of thing. And I am amazed that an organic wholesaler sells that .

To the poster above - buzzy110 was sarcastic - in case you know what that means . and I was not going to say much because it incites exactly that sort of response you just gave.

It helps to inform yourself and not just buy the cheapest available alternative - in case you want to look at yourself in the mirror every morning.

Chef_uli, Jun 9, 6:07 am

I, for one, still cook from scratch, as, no doubt, do many others who used to post.

I now very seldom post recipes, queries or comments in any thread. Too much abuse, too many personal comments taken from here, edited and reposted in this and other forums.

I'm guessing, there are many like me, who now read but don't post.

Chef_kay141, Jun 9, 7:20 am

I have always used kremelta and butter in my icing, very fattening but everyone that eats them enjoys the icing. It helps the icing keep its shape.

Chef_slimgym, Jun 9, 8:40 am

Agree with you 100% Kay, as Iíve just found out why would you contribute simply to be rubbished. I never wanted to associate with the bully girls group during my school days, most definitely not starting now! Thankfully tho they are fewer in number than the genuine helpful nonjudgmental posters whoís contributions are much enjoyed.

Chef_strowan1, Jun 9, 8:40 pm

This is the one I use, if you live in Wellington there is a little shop that sells it, also the USA shop in Johnsonville can probably get Crisco if you really want. This place also does online orders. https://cupcakesweeties.co.nz/products/sno-creme-large-720gm-vegetable-creme-shortening I have made 'buttercream' with this and it gives a great base for vibrant colours but doesn't taste as good as real buttercream (in my opinion). You can do half and half and it is a little better. It doesn't taste terrible but it isn't as good. You can also buy Lorann oils for flavouring which does improve it considerably. Until this become available I used to try and use kremelta but it really was quite difficult to use, the snocreme is soft and ready to use and lasts for ages.

Chef_madj, Jun 9, 10:43 pm

Sno Creme (sometimes called Sno Whip) is also available on TM.

Cake decorators use it instead of butter to achieve a much whiter buttercream for bridal cakes, and one can also buy colourless vanilla for the same purpose (a whiter icing or cake).

Chef_autumnwinds, Jun 9, 11:10 pm

Very judgemental post, uli.
Not all of us use packets etc to cook with.
This forum is not only for people who cook from scratch, is it?
Has it ever occurred to you that this could be a learning curve for a lot of people . so helpful comments would be desirable, instead of a couple of posters putting down posters food choices that don't fit with their own ideas?
Cooking is not a 'one size fits all' thing & it's not up to any of us to judge food choices, is it?

Chef_samanya, Jun 9, 11:16 pm

Thankfully I missed that one Uli. It is tragic to see how people's ideas of cooking have been shaped by the manufacturers of fake food.

Chef_davidt4, Jun 10, 12:27 am

I agree - this forum has a lot of potential to help new cooks, and I always try to be helpful when I can. However when someone specifically asks for advice on "flavour sachets" I have no expertise. It would be a waste of time typing out a "from scratch " slow cooker chicken recipe when that is not what was requested.

Chef_davidt4, Jun 10, 12:32 am

Well . be careful davidt4 :)
You might go onto the list of those "very judgemental people" which obviously includes me and buzzy110, if you post another of your lovely recipes without packages and all done from scratch.

By the way - have you got some great chestnut recipes? If yes please open another thread, so we won't interfere here. I have about 25kgs all cooked and painfully peeled in the freezer now and am running out of new good ideas on how to use them - and yes I have googled.

Chef_uli, Jun 10, 12:45 am

Sorry, I have hardly ever done anything with chestnuts other than boiling them and serving with butter. Iíll have a look in some of my cook books and will start a new thread if I come up with anything.

Chef_davidt4, Jun 10, 1:51 am

Wow, #16, 17 and 18 are, IMO, prime examples of the condescending and unhelpful posts which have taken over this forum.

Thank goodness for the net and the many helpful FB groups, where people can ask questions without being judged, criticised and abused. Where very few recipes have packets in them but if they do, they are accepted.

Of course FB groups do not suit the bullies as they are not or shouldn''t be anonymous.

Chef_kay141, Jun 10, 2:05 am

That's true . I don't use them either, obviously a lot do.
I used one once & it was awful, so never again.
I have used a lot of recipes that you have given & thanks for them.
As I said it's not a 'one size fits all' scenario.
imo it's better to be helpful where one can, rather than put people off by being judgemental about their food choices.

Chef_samanya, Jun 10, 2:08 am

Yes that is my problem too - however as it happens the trees grow up around you and after more then 20 years you get more and more interesting things to harvest and are expected to do something with them of course (never mind the pigs who always know what to do with anything you throw at them - even onion peels! ).

The best I did recently was cook them in red wine, then add cream and chilli, salt and some fresh herbs and serve them instead of potatoes etc.

I have tried all the "cakes" that float around the net, but since I do not eat cakes anyway it seemed a bit of a waste for all those hours of cooking and peeling.

Maybe I will be "organized" next season and sell them on TM - they sold for $12 a kilo here at the local Growers Market - so I might get rich yet (or at least pay my Osteopath. )

Chef_uli, Jun 10, 5:20 am

WOW again - I post here about once or twice a month - which means you must have lots and lots of other bullies - who are they?

As to FB - if you think those people are really using their own names and not post anonymous - then you must be very naive. I never thought that of you kay141. Actually very disconcerting for me.

Chef_uli, Jun 10, 5:23 am

leave it uli.
Learn when to pull your head in & stop targeting people.
It would be great if recipes could get back to being a helpful forum, without the negativity shown by a couple of posters . simply because not every one has the time to be 'slow cooks' or grow their own food, like you & me.
If there are threads asking advice re packet mixes . fine, as davidt4 said, don't contribute if you are not familiar with packet mixes.
The people asking about them don't need a lecture about what they should be eating.
Who knows, if people feel welcome here, they may read other threads & not be afraid to ask/comment, for fear of being shot down by those who think they have the perfect diet & superior knowledge about everything & hence they may learn a lot & their choices re food may change, because they are given helpful suggestions about choices, without aggression.
david4t manages this very well & you could too.
You are knowledgeable about a lot of things relating to cooking & can be helpful, but there is no need to disparage others who are seeking advice that doesn't relate to your ideals.
Staying out of threads where you can't offer anything positive would be a start.

Chef_samanya, Jun 10, 6:00 am

I'm sorry that this thread has become rather off topic . I hope you got the answers that you were after.

Chef_samanya, Jun 10, 6:02 am

What a personally insulting post. Try debating the subject and not the person.

I don't know what you do on FB but they do have a policy of real names being used. It is also in their rules. All those I have had contact with on the various groups are following the rules. Also the administrators of those groups are much stricter and do delete member and posts which are unfair, critical or in any other way demeaning to others. That obviously doesn't happen here.

Chef_kay141, Jun 10, 6:06 am

Sarcasm, condescension, & repartee have apparently become the new " bullying". an over utilised "catch all" term these days.
Ironically - particularly popular with sanctimonious bossy bits who in other quarters are guilty of the same. seemingly protecting the weak while practising the same behaviour - minus the wit. or wits?

Chef_lizzie51, Jun 10, 6:07 am

I thoroughly agree!

No-one wants to be "lectured" when they share a recipe that has a little sugar in it, for example, and not everyone knows how to grow their own vegetables (let alone actually grow them), and it all comes out as being so superior, and off-putting, it's no wonder so few post these days. I've even been told off for bumping a very informative post of some years standing. well, it's gone now, as I'm not going to be aggravated by someone elses aggression. And a little treat, very now and then, isn't going to hurt anyone - but should NOT be immediately jumped on by the "sugar is evil" types.

A couple of good sayings to live by:
"Live, and let live. "
"Moderation in all things - including moderation. "

Chef_autumnwinds, Jun 10, 7:09 am

You just put a smile on my face in fact it broke out to a little more than just a smile. I am thinking along the lines of my bathroom, with one full length mirror.

Chef_pickles7, Jun 10, 7:21 am

Hey you xx . I have had a few tips & recipes from you so thanks for your input.
Let's hope that the 'live & let live' philosophy will prevail & we can all offer help, where we can, without the aggression re what's healthy & what's not.

Chef_samanya, Jun 10, 7:34 am

Thee and me are classic examples of being able to get along, whatever our other differences. and being able to find the joy in food, our gardens, and our lives. XX back

Chef_autumnwinds, Jun 10, 11:56 am


Chef_samanya, Jun 10, 11:12 pm

There isn't anything better than butter,.

Chef_pickles7, Jun 10, 11:50 pm


Chef_samanya, Jun 11, 4:38 am

So true.

Chef_buzzy110, Jun 11, 4:53 am

Ah, well, I guess it's all about how you use it.

I limit access, find it helpful keeping in touch with others around the world, join special interest groups and use it to keep up to date with information from various organisations, such as the local council. I also occasionally use it to sell goods.

I have never been abused, stalked or trolled and, to my knowledge, nothing I have posted there has been copied, edited enough to make me look bad and someone else look good, then posted elsewhere. Nor have my sales been trashed, trolled or generally sabotaged.

This is more than I can say for this website.

Like many, I now read but will post here infrequently. It is no longer safe to do so.

Chef_kay141, Jun 11, 11:44 pm

I agree about this site. Various posters made it their raison d-etre on these boards to troll, stalk (and some still are doing this), abuse and edit past posts to make me look bad. Apart from you, there was one other who was a skilled archivist who excelled at doing the latter and took great delight in doing so.

Even in this thread I have been accused of wrecking this particular board because I gave negative information about kremelta. I would accept that as fair but when another poster, recently, made the most awful remarks about a recipe suggestion from Petal, I was the only person who defended her because the negative poster was part of your little coterie that used to constantly abuse me. And surprise, surprise it was me who was abused for my defending another poster.

In the meantime, I do not see any problem with helping people to realise that hydrogenated fats lead to heart disease and dementia. Research and dissection of blocked arteries has shown that the main fats involved in arterial blockage in and around the heart, and even more scarily, the brain, are hydrogenated fats. This is why they are now banned in America and NZ will soon be following suit.

Chef_buzzy110, Jun 12, 12:28 am

Once again, you make it all about you. Not once, have I attacked or criticised you, just debated your posts, but you seem intent on doing that to others.

You may think I'm a skilled archivist and I am in my specialised subjects but never on here. I have no interest in editing your posts or making you look bad. There is no need to do that.

Chef_kay141, Jun 12, 1:03 am

I think the skilled archivist that Buzzy mentioned is a poster who was banned some years ago for breaching TM rules.

Chef_davidt4, Jun 12, 2:59 am

Doesn't matter who it is or whether they are banned. It doesn't hide the fact that, nearly every day, posters on these message boards are insulted, lectured as though they are unintelligent, and generally criticised by a few. Nor does it hide the fact that was is posted, whether comments or auctions, on here is not protected by any sort of privacy and will be manipulated by some.

Chef_kay141, Jun 12, 4:33 am

I know exactly who the skilled archivist was & she is a highly intelligent, learned woman (some may be quite surprised at who she is) who gave helpful advice, but I guess like a lot, she took exception to some 'preachy' attitudes displayed at times & it's a great pity that such posters are sadly in the minority now & she was banned when she spoke out when I was personally attacked . not by any one here though.
This board was better for her input.

Chef_samanya, Jun 12, 4:51 am

Takes one to know one. "The lady doth protest too much" Hypocrisy is complaining about a certain type of behaviour whilst indulging in it to the full.

I have agreed with pickles who said, without rancour, that nothing is better than butter. What sort of shortening do you suggest?

Chef_buzzy110, Jun 12, 4:57 am

Only if you were part of her band of bullies. For those whom she encouraged her group of bullies to victimise, it was a totally different feeling.

Chef_buzzy110, Jun 12, 5:02 am

Once again, a personal attack. This is an interesting response as, not once, have I targeted you or anyone else. I have kept it general.

I don't bake any more but would never dare suggest anything. Who knows how that would be amended or where it would land.

Chef_kay141, Jun 12, 5:12 am

She took pretentious preaching types of people to task & justifiably so.
If you feel that you fell into that category well ask yourself, why?

Chef_samanya, Jun 12, 6:35 am

You got that right. There was nothing wrong with your first post. It is plain to see a few lingerers' are still about.

Chef_pickles7, Jun 12, 6:50 am

I too don't come to the TM MB much anymore.

EVERY single thread I have clicked in to tonight has been turned into nasty, so I came to recipes - WOW.

This is an alternative for buttercream that I particularly like, an egg white beaten in after all the butter is beaten in lightens it even more. I like the recipes where the sugar is cooked with the flour and milk, but some recipes add the sugar after giving it a grainy feel. It's known as flour frosting or ermine icing/frosting and is a beaut cake filling and piped onto cupcakes.


Chef_oopie, Jun 12, 6:52 am

Ask yourself why some only 'linger'?
Maybe it's because of a band of know all bullies?
Heard of Robert Burns?
He had some great quotes
"Oh wad some power the giftie gie us To see oursel's as others see us!

It wad frae monie a blunder free us, And foolish notion."

Chef_samanya, Jun 12, 6:54 am

So true.

Sorry to say, I doubt it will make any difference to the arrogance, condescension or breaches of privacy.

Chef_kay141, Sep 1, 1:57 am

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